Tuesday, September 3, 2013

Beyond redemption and salvation

This post is directed towards those Christians that for some reason or another think that they could persuade me into believing once again in their book of myths and fairy tales. To those who think that I would degrade myself again and bow down to the imaginary guy in the sky and his fictional son, I dare say that it is indeed something that will never happen. Where you see a book inspired by God, I see a book that was written, edited, and produced entirely by man. In fact, even the selection process of which books should be put into the Christian canon is entirely a human endeavor with no need for nor intervention of a deity of any kind.

 "This is a work of fiction. Names, characters, places, events and incidents are either the products of the author’s imagination or used in a fictitious manner. Any resemblance to actual persons, living or dead, or actual events is purely coincidental." This statement should be included on the cover of every copy of the Bible in existence.

I always find it amusing when theists assume that I have not read the Bible. They insist that if I did that I too would see that it could not have been the work of men. That I too would see the divine stamp of the so called invisible guy in the sky all over it. The truth is that I have read the Bible in its entirety. In fact, I have read it four times from cover to cover! The first time I read it as a deluded evangelist who at the time believed myself that my faith was unshakeable. But the first reading had the opposite effect. Instead of being more secure in my beliefs it made more sure that there was something very wrong with my beliefs. 

It's ironic, but contrary to what many may think of me aside from my experiences in the church and ministry it was actually reading the Bible that eventually led to my rejecting the faith! After I left the church I realized that this was quite a common occurrence. Some of atheism's most well known proponents were at one time believers. People like John Loftus, Robert M. Price, Hector Avalos, Dan Barker, Bart Ehrman, Richard Carrier, etal. All of these men formerly mentioned are now renowned biblical scholars and all of them admit that the more they sought to know about the Bible and its truth; the more they came to the realization that it was just not so. 

I don't know about them, but there is not a man or woman of God on this earth that could ever drag me back into their superstitious beliefs. I remember when I finally decided to call it quits in 1994' that the last prayer I prayed to the Lord who I still believed in reluctantly, was that if he wanted me back that he had to prove to me that he exist. I asked him to give me the same privilege he gave Thomas who did not believe that he had come back from the dead but Jesus came to him and fulfilled his request. 

When it comes to salvation I demand proof and concrete evidence of the existence of this biblical god, and confirmation that the tales spun on his behalf in the scriptures are true beyond a shadow of a doubt. Faith is not enough for me, I cannot make a life commitment based on empty hopes with nothing to back them up. 

When I left the church for good I took my Bible and set it on fire and watched it burn to ashes. To many this may seem a little extreme, but the act itself held a lot of symbolism for me. Watching that book of myths and superstitions burn to ashes represented the falling away of the shackles of myths that had once held me down for so long. 

This image of course is not my Bible but it brings to remembrance the sense of freedom I felt when I literally was able to free my mind. There are many biblical quotes that I use to try to explain this but there is one in particular that suits my purposes just fine. I know it is being quoted out of context but in this case that is intentional.

"Then you will know the truth, and the truth will set you free." John 8:32

I did not find the truth in the Bible or in a belief in the figure of a fictional Christ. I found the truth when I relinquished my beliefs in superstitions. When I stopped making arguments in favor of faith which in the arena of reason faith has no place. I found the truth when I realized that reality is much more better than fantasy, and that believing in false hopes would only lead as it has done so for almost two thousand years to self delusions. 

The Bible says that there is one sin that is unforgivable which in the grand scheme of things makes no sense whatsoever. Considering that according to the scriptures all manner of sin will be forgiven. Rape, incest, murder, pedophilia, adultery, fornication, bestiality, homosexuality, violent crimes involving assault, robbery, lying, cheating, and stealing, etc. ad infinitum. But there is one thing that get's under God's skin so bad that even he cannot forgive it! Are you  ready for it?

30“Whoever is not with me is against me, and whoever does not gather with me scatters. 31And so I tell you, every kind of sin and slander can be forgiven, but blasphemy against the Spirit will not be forgiven. 32Anyone who speaks a word against the Son of Man will be forgiven, but anyone who speaks against the Holy Spirit will not be forgiven, either in this age or in the age to come. 
Matthew 12:30-32 

That's right folks, speaking about the Holy Spirit in a derogatory manner also known as blasphemy is unforgivable! It is the ultimate death sentence! I am glad to report that I have done this on several occasions so please stop wasting your time trying to save me. As the title of this post states I am beyond redemption and salvation. Although I find it ironic that this is the one sin that God could not forgive when the Bible clearly states that there is nothing impossible for God.

Jesus looked at them and said, "With man this is impossible, but with God all things are possible."
 Matthew 19:26 

I know this refers to the difficulty of a rich man being saved and entering into the Kingdom of God, but I am focusing on the "nothing is impossible" part. Obviously salvation for someone who has blasphemed against the Spirit is. From a logical standpoint does that make sense to you? That you could commit all manner of sin and immoralities and that a few words you speak that the good Lord does not like can damn you for all eternity? This is just one more of the many absurdities contained in the scriptures. 

The truth is that I don't want to be "saved" because I don't feel the need to be saved from anything at all. I don't believe in God and sin if defined as an offense to God or of his commandments becomes null and void outside of a religious context. I have been saved already when I realized the depths of my delusions as a believer. When I saw that Bible and its teaching for what they were: man made superstitions and myths. I am free from the lies that turn man against man and that is the cause of so much hate and prejudice in the world. I am free to think for myself and make my own decisions and to use my mind in a rational and logical way in the process. Truth dispels myths and shines the light on the darkness of ancient superstitions.   

Note: All biblical citations are taken from the New International Version of the scriptures. 


  1. With respect, you seem to be crying out to God. This is not an atheist post for an atheist site (IMO) no chat about say creationism or a young Earth or evolution or the big bang. This post seems to be for you, by you, about you and because of you. I can’t see it is directed at Christians.

    You have rejected the Bible fine I get that. However the reasons for you rejecting it are based on your opinions. Others have different opinions. You have read the Bible four times. So? In a previous post I did recommend that you read it for a fifth time, which is not excessive, reading it from God’s perspective.

    You have the opinion that a lot of Christians become atheists after reading the Bible. Actually for most, their faith is strengthened. Also many become Christians through reading the Bible. Nobody wants to drag you into superstitious beliefs and no Christian wants to try and save you as you are already saved. You are just simply missing out on a relationship with God and that is your choice. So many people in the world, even in this modern age, have a relationship with God. They are not shackled at all. But of course you know the truth and we (millions of us) have got it all wrong.

    You demand proof and evidence. And who are you exactly? You are proud to be able to declare that you are beyond redemption and salvation but again, that is just your opinion. You demand confirmation of God, that the Scriptures are true beyond a shadow of a doubt and you say that faith is not enough for you. But why are you so special. Why should God show up in your house? And what is all this “invisible guy in the sky” stuff, have you been watching Ricky Gervais? The point here is that if God proved Himself to you, by tapping you on the shoulder and saying “Here I am, what’s up?” then you would have an unfair advantage over every other human being.

    “Then you will know the Truth and the Truth will set you free” is a sentence where the phrase ‘The Truth’ means Jesus Christ. Now read it again.

    The Holy Spirit. Well, you once again spin things to make you look clever and the writers of Scripture all look like uneducated, daft morons. Rather than go into the ins and outs of the Holy Spirit, I suspect you know the real truth anyway, so I will just say this. If your daughter got caught stealing, or your son was bullying someone, then you would still love them, try and make them see the errors of their ways and for sure forgive them. However, if your child, or your mum or anyone you loved so dearly came up to you and said “f**k off “ it would hit your spirit hard (or your psyche if you prefer). It would probably be harder for you to forget that (or forgive) even though it would be a much smaller bad act than a real crime. If you want to understand the power of the spirit, just the one within you, then go up to the person you love the most and shout at them that you hate them. Then shout at them that you love them. Measure the difference in your feelings; it will be palpable and real. How much more so then with the Holy Spirit.

    Finally, you say that burning the Bible freed you mind. My minds free and I have not burned anything. You seem to be so sure that people around the world are living in some kind of bondage or chains or are slaves to myths, people like myself. Don’t worry about it because we’re not. We are free, very free, so free it feels like we are flying.

    Yes. “The Truth will set you free”

    1. wow! So you are outright declaring that although I have blasphemed against the Holy Spirit I am still saved? That is not what the Bible says. Can you say cherry picking? Because once again terence that is exactly what you are doing. There is no spin in that text it is quite clear that this sin will not be forgiven. Yet you keep insisting that I am saved. I suggest you read the Bible again.

      Also, the gift of salvation is free but you have to maintain your salvation by obeying God's word. Not so much the ritualistic laws but the moral laws which by the way are still valid. If not then anyone can call themselves Christian and thus saved simply because they belief the Jesus died and rose from the dead.

      Think about this for a minute. If what you say is true that means that the local drug dealer, prostitute, murderer who got away with the crime, etc. are saved too!It doesn't matter if they continue to sell drugs or their body they are saved. But Jesus clearly states in the scriptures that you must obey his commandments.

      "If you love me, keep my commands. John 14:15
      In fact, this is love for God: to keep his commands. And his commands are not burdensome, 1 John 5:3
      Therefore, my brothers and sisters, make every effort to confirm your calling and election. For if you do these things, you will never stumble, 2 Peter 1:10

      Read that last text in context so that you can see what it means. Doing things to confirm your calling implies active participation. Are you a Catholic by any chance? I'm just trying to understand your position because you seem to be a weak and lazy Christian to me. You keep insisting that I am saved although your own Bible says I'm not.

      “Not everyone who says to me, ‘Lord, Lord,’ will enter the kingdom of heaven, but only the one who does the will of my Father who is in heaven. Matthew 7:21

      Once again although salvation is the free gift of God it requires not just acknowledging that Jesus died and rose from the dead. Repentance of your sins is key and submission to the will of God as it is interpreted throughout the scriptures.

      Finally, if you would have read my post more closely you would have seen that I said I was quoting John 8:32 out of context on purpose. Reading comprehension is obviously not your strong suit. I have learned the truth that the Bible is no different from all the other mythical holy books every written and that all gods are the creations of men. That's my opinion.

    2. Chat, sorry to say so, but I think Terence is getting a bit annoying...

    3. I agree, Paul. I am curious to know if he is Catholic because he sure sounds like one. That is the only branch of Christianity that I know of where you can live in sin and still claim that you are saved. The cherry pickers love to play the old "that's your interpretation" card.

    4. Finally and for the last time terence faith is not a valid means of discovery. You claim to have a relationship with your god but so do the Muslims and all the other believers of the myriad gods that man has created for himself. Like you they all claim to know and have the truth. The fact of the matter is that you are all deluded.

      Delusion: a persistent false psychotic belief regarding the self or persons or objects outside the self that is maintained despite indisputable evidence to the contrary; also : the abnormal state marked by such beliefs http://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/delusion

    5. Terence,

      "We are free, very free, so free it feels like we are flying."

      There are a number of drugs that have that same effect.

  2. You can also blaspheme the Holy Spirit - it actually says in the Bible that that is the one sin that will never be forgiven. So fuck the Holy Spirit in the ass with a chainsaw. The Holy Spirit can suck on my balls.

    1. I've blasphemed the fucking Holy Spirit so much that its gotten old. It's hard to offend something that does not exist Matt. The same goes for God. As us atheists tend to say "blasphemy is a victimless crime."

    2. If you want to spend your time proving a God you don’t believe in doesn’t exist, then fine.

      You have said that I am welcome here as I have been polite, however it seems to be okay from your side to attack, ridicule and mock me.

      I am no shrinking violet and have no problem; I have been involved in a lot of stuff over the years. Nevertheless, the amount of disparagement now (re-read your post) is becoming pretty high. And to start swearing shows a lack of English and little class.

      If I have offended or become annoying (as someone said) I am truly sorry to have come across like that, it was never my intention. I have listened to the views written but just totally disagree with them I can’t help that. Further, I don’t get impressed with the wholesale use of Scripture to interweave barbed hits upon my genuine efforts to help you understand my position of an applicable faith outlook.

      I am not a Catholic (although my dealings with them have always been nice so I don’t say that in any aloof manner) I attend a Baptist Church.

      I am offended that you feel I am a lazy and a weak Christian. I work hard including within my Christian circles, a lifestyle that has brought me much reward. Although just like everyone else, I have ups and downs, I am comfortable in my Church duties and activities and again, I apologise if I have not been able to relay the purposes of my way of life within the remit of this blog. I felt I might have been able to bring some equilibrium to the one-way traffic of monopoly agreement, a simple thought in which I have obviously failed.

      I appreciate the time you have given me; I really do as I have, for the most part enjoyed the debates and challenges. There is no desire to come to this blog to antagonise.

    3. You are not antagonizing me I am just trying to understand where you are coming from. You claimed once that you did not need to attend a church and that salvation is a free gift. You even went as far as saying that I'm saved that I just lack a relationship with God! That is fundamentalist thinking. You interpret the Bible like a typical Catholic lay person who goes to church on Sunday and acts like a a total ass all week long living and acting like he was never redeemed. Eat drink and be merry for on Sunday we partake of communion and get a clean slate! That is what you seem to be saying at times.

      Now you are saying that you are an active member of your church which you claim is Baptist. I tend to curse sometimes it depends on who I am talking to. I am not attacking your views I am ably refuting them using your own Bible which you deny by saying I am interpreting or misusing the texts which are quite clear in meaning.

      You are the classic example of a cherry picker in my view and that is my opinion. Just like you believe I am saved lol. I don't spend my time to prove that God existss i have better things to do. But I share my views and experiences because I feel that they can help others who were in the same position I was in to break free from the bondages of superstition and fear.

  3. The FFRF does make stickers for bibles BTW.

    1. I know those stickers should be a requirement on all Bible covers or in the inside jacket.

  4. What the fuck is the Holy Spirit anyway? I've never gotten a decent answer to that question. They used to say "Holy Ghost" - well, who is it a ghost of since it supposedly existed before any human. Was there an older god who died before Jehova? LOL.

  5. Replies
    1. Do not be afraid of those who kill the body but cannot kill the soul. Rather, be afraid of the One who can destroy both soul and body in hell. Matthew 10:28 (NIV)

      Sounds like one hell of a loving guy indeed! He demands fear followed by the threat of eternal torment.

      What do you mean with God is love? Do you care to elaborate? Do you mean he is the personification of love or is this one of his many attributes? It's hard to represent love in any way when technically you don't exist. I'm just saying.